Thursday Open Thread

52
  by: Colorado Pols Thu June 21, 2012 at 3:38 PM MDT

“Adversity makes men, and prosperity makes monsters.”

–Victor Hugo


Full story: Thursday Open Thread

52 Community Comments, Facebook Comments

  1. dwyer says:
    Thu June 21, 2012 at 3:53 PM MDT

    From my post of June 11th:


    Wisconsin 2

    There are still many lessons to be learned from Wisconsin.  For example, this is what I 
learned from a Tea Party caller to a nationally syndicated right wing talk show on the day of the election, prior to the polls closing. She was calling from a town in Wisconsin and was confident that Walker was going to win.  These were her talking points.  I had not heard all of them before, and she sounded well versed.

    1)( Democrats create chaos and voters are sick of it.  She talked about the occupation of the State House; the constant crowds at the State Capitol, and the “runaway Democratic legislators. She said that when democrats don’t get their way, they use chaos as a weapon.  Then she linked dems to the Occupy Movement and finally the riots in Europe.   In discussing the various political occupations, she alluded to the resulting “unsanitary” conditions in public spaces; defecation, etc.

    I think we may continue to hear variations along these lines…dems  use chaos or the threat of chaos to get their own way.  For example, I heard on other talk shows that the reason the Republican governor and the Republican prosecutor “had to” 
Charge Zimmerman was that they were dealing with the “threat” of urban riots. 
(This wasn’t true…but it demonstrates the expansion of this particular propaganda..”The democrats use chaos or the threat of chaos to get their way.)

    Today, boyles started his show with a quote from Milton Friedman, the African-American actor.  I will paraphrase it, here, Freeman said that if Obama were not re-elected, there would be “troubles”. He went on to say that this would be due to the right wing.  However, boyles asked his audience to “speculate” about what the quote meant. Could Freeman be referring to urban riots…a la after the Rodney King verdict?

    I think this is serious stuff.  I think there should be an immediate response from the Democratic National Committee. I don’t think that “talking points” that suggest that the dems, in any way shape or form,

    are threatening violence should be allowed to go unanswered.

    • Duke Coxdukeco1 says:
      Thu June 21, 2012 at 4:20 PM MDT

      you are confusing the black actor, Morgan Freeman, with the very white and long dead economist, Milton Friedman.

      • dwyer says:
        Thu June 21, 2012 at 4:54 PM MDT

        I googled the actor and thought that I had correctly identified the proper person.  I apologize.

      • VanDammerVanDammer says:
        Thu June 21, 2012 at 5:53 PM MDT

        why paraphrase when you can find his statement  in the time it took to blockquote yourself?  Here is a piece of the Morgan Freeman transcript from PBS Tavis SMiley appearance on Tuesday, June 19:

        “MORGAN FREEMAN: I think that we did a really good thing when we elected Barack Obama. I read his books, they read his books. He is absolutely and totally qualified for the job. He has proven himself to be not only qualified for the job, but very good at it. The things that he’s managed to get accomplished in the face of so much push back is amazing. And I think, this is Morgan Freeman’s personal thought, we’re going to be in a lot of trouble if we don’t reelect him because people on the other side of the fence scare me.”

        But WND and Ass-Boyles and NewsBlusters and whole rightie media having a field day headlining with a black man invoking “trouble” and making sure it has some menace.

        The rightie game is pathetic whereby they dismiss the outta touch liberalism of Hollywood elite but then trot out a simple 2 phrase statement by a venerated black actor as some kind of eye-opening race war precursor.

        I do fear the red meat righties, the evangelicals, the birthers, the ass-puckered conservative warhawks, the 10thers, the Oath Keepers, the Paulites, the Personhooders, the Tancredos, the Creationist, the “drill, baby, drill” crowd, and too many more.  And they are all on the less-green doom & gloom side of the proverbial fence. Is my fear unfounded?

           

        • dwyer says:
          Thu June 21, 2012 at 7:12 PM MDT

          I just heard it on the radio, I didn’t catch where it originally appeared.  It is the fact that the entire right wing media machine is using it and I just put my quote up because that was the first time I heard those talking points, that are now reverberating.

          The problem is that this is propaganda and it is indoctrinating millions of people.  That is why I demand that there be a coordinated democratic response…..because whether or not you realize it,  people casually listening to the radio….and …if you want traffic or weather on 90% of am radio, you are listening to conservative radio and you get that slant along with what is happening with rush hour.

          When the dems do not response…and I think there is a lot of fear among dems….then the average person thinks there must be something to the propaganda…..and is reinforced in the bias that at least right wing radio is getting at the truth.

    • RedGreenRedGreen says:
      Thu June 21, 2012 at 4:33 PM MDT

      … to the rantings of Peter Boyles? You think the DNC should immediately start talking about whether or not an Obama defeat will lead to urban riots?

      I’m not sure even Milton Friedman would agree that’s a wise move.

      • dwyer says:
        Thu June 21, 2012 at 5:01 PM MDT

        The reason I referenced my own comment from June 11th is that I don’t think boyles thinks this stuff up on his own…I think he is reinforcing a talking point that I first heard back on June 11. The inference also echoed

        earlier during the Martin-Zimmerman controversy.

        What happens rg, and I think that you might be aware of this, is the hundreds of hours of right wing talk radio locally and nationally, reinforce each other and

        propagandize certain themes.

        • RedGreenRedGreen says:
          Thu June 21, 2012 at 5:37 PM MDT

          And you shine a light on it, which is good. But to bring these discussions out of their right-wing cesspool and give them credence by involving the DNC in explicit rebuttals … I just don’t think that’s a good idea.

          • DavidThi808DavidThi808 says:
            Thu June 21, 2012 at 6:16 PM MDT

            Is to get the message across without speaking directly to the right wingers who are trying to make this a meme. So you find another avenue to talk about our love for democracy and how that means we abide by the will of the electorate – or something like that.

            • dwyer says:
              Thu June 21, 2012 at 7:41 PM MDT

              I think a great democratic commercial would veto begin with a video of  John Lewis on the floor of the HOUSE enraged and eloquent and in tears because a fellow Georgian Representative, republican, had introduced a resolution to order the Justice Department not to spend one cent enforcing the provisions of the 1965 Voting Rights Act. The Representative did withdraw his resolution.  

              Now I don’t know if parties can use outtakes from the floor of the House in political commercials.  If they can not, then I still think that John Lewis would be very effective in describing what non-violence is and how effective it was during the civil rights revolution and

              how the republicans were trying to ‘gut’ civil rights voting legislation by denying money to fund it.  I think that would be very powerful.

              My point is that the dems have had at least ten days to know that these talking points were coming down the pike…and they should have been prepared to answer the smears….

              • dwyer says:
                Thu June 21, 2012 at 7:46 PM MDT

                The eyes are going and I am sorry.

                I think a great democratic commercial would veto begin with a video

                should read:

                I think a great democratic commercial would begin with a video

        • VanDammerVanDammer says:
          Thu June 21, 2012 at 5:59 PM MDT

          his ClearChannel content producers get fed topics & talking points that further the big CC brand and their conservative talker products

          They’re not converting folks to their side but just making sure their low-quotient thinkers get enough sips of the kool-aid to keep ‘em twitchy & afraid.  

          • dwyer says:
            Thu June 21, 2012 at 7:43 PM MDT

            They’re not converting folks to their side but just making sure their low-quotient thinkers get enough sips of the kool-aid to keep ‘em twitchy & afraid

            And you know this how?  You are all-knowing? You think that the dems won in Wisconsin, in 2010 and in MA. Those “low-quotient thinkers” vote, too.

            This is a typical dem response: Ignore, belittle, repeat.

            • VanDammerVanDammer says:
              Thu June 21, 2012 at 8:50 PM MDT

              not telling you anything you don’t know but look at the rating for radio listenership — pretty much no one on right is blazing trails & putting up outrageous numbers from one quarter to next.  

              If you look at 2012 Portable People Meter stats you’ll see that ClearChannel’s KHOW has  a .3 share decline in just 4 mos (2.7 in Feb down to 2.4 in May) so proof of dip in listenership.

              Then check out Alexa for web metrics. You’ll  see the likes of conservative aggregator WND, a site that serves to pump up the volume of the rightie echo chamber, and others of that ilk aren’t really blazing new trails in gaining eyeballs.  WND demographics are solidly white males 55 yrs and older with some education, 85% domestic viewership with Michael Savage sourcing the highest number of link thrus.  That sure seems like a homogeneous pool of believers that visit & revisit same media sources to further support their already determined mindset.    

              BTW, I don’t ignore the right at all and resent your assumption of ignorance on the part of anyone that doesn’t hew to your heed & call.  

  2. SSG_Dan says:
    Thu June 21, 2012 at 4:40 PM MDT

    Rob Zombie to Direct Hockey-Themed Movie ‘Broad Street Bullies’

    Rob Zombie is giving up Michael Myers’ mask in favor of a real hockey mask. The rocker-turned director has reportedly signed on to direct the upcoming film, ‘Broad Street Bullies,’ about the ’70s-era Philadelphia Flyers team that knocked off the Soviet Union’s team in a brutal competition.

    Deadline reports that Zombie was interested in stepping outside of the horror genre, and was interested in the project. He’ll reportedly direct, write and produce the film, and says he likens the tone to ‘Boogie Nights’ meets ‘Rocky.’

    http://loudwire.com/rob-zombie…

  3. Ralphie says:
    Thu June 21, 2012 at 5:51 PM MDT

    Meat is well into its stall at 173.

    Lit the charcoal at 9:30 last night, put the meat on at 10:00.

    I got up twice to check the smoker temperature, it was about 215 both times with no babysitting.

    It’s been running 11.5 hours now without adding charcoal.

    I’m impressed with how the Bullet works.

    • Gray in Mountains says:
      Thu June 21, 2012 at 7:33 PM MDT

      but geez, I’ve already got 5 and none seem like they are going to break

      • Ralphie says:
        Thu June 21, 2012 at 7:53 PM MDT

        But the Weber is great for a casual backyard smoker like me.  Only had it since Christmas, still getting used to the idea of being laid back because it won’t go out of control on me.

        12 hrs and 45 minutes, coming out of the stall now at 181.  I figure another hour or so and I’ll pull the meat out.

        By the way, looking back at my log, I found a cut BlueCat can smoke in less than a day.  Boneless shoulder, the kind that comes wrapped in string.  More expensive than bone-in, but the last one I smoked was done in five hours @225.

        • Gray in Mountains says:
          Thu June 21, 2012 at 8:12 PM MDT

          I had one for 20 years and I’m on my second kettle now. Several years ago I got a 55 gal drum and cut it down to sit between  kettle and lid. Almost a perfect fit, needed little modification.  

        • AristotleAristotle says:
          Thu June 21, 2012 at 8:21 PM MDT

          Pork shoulder? Brisket? Something else?

          Did you consider the Big Green Egg before settling on the bullet? (Maybe not if it was a gift.) I know someone on another forum who swears by his.

          I like my Weber grill pretty well, but they don’t seem to make cast iron grates for them (maybe because it takes time to heat them up, but I’d put extra charcoal in if needed.) I can buy a slightly smaller diameter one and rest it on the one it came with, but that takes it just a bit further from the heat – which might not be a big deal, but somehow I just don’t like the idea.

        • BlueCat says:
          Fri June 22, 2012 at 8:48 AM MDT

          And sometimes boneless isn’t really more expensive or negligibly so because bones weigh a lot. On the other hand, bone in can be tastier and I love gnawing on bones. But something that gets done in 5 or 6 hours sounds like a plan.

          And since this is already my third comment for the day I’d like to tack on something unrelated.

          What’s up with the whole dywer/dwyer thing (please note I was the first to point it out, dwyer. You’re welcome.)?  Could it be more fun and games from Libertad.20?

  4. SSG_Dan says:
    Thu June 21, 2012 at 6:46 PM MDT

    I was just wondering if we could ask The Orange Man (AKA the Teabagger’s Bitch) and the rest of the Majority Party when they plan to work on that “Jobs” thing they ran on in ’10.

    Because, instead of that “jobs” thing, they’ve passed:

    *46 bills on abortion

    *113 bills on religion

    *73 bills on family relationships

    *36 bills on marriage

    *72 bills on firearms

    *604 bills on taxation

    *467 bills on government investigation.

    And, blocked the American Jobs Act.

    Just wanted to update everyone on the numbers….

    • Sir RobinSir Robin says:
      Thu June 21, 2012 at 7:57 PM MDT

      It gives new meaning to fiddling while Rome burns.

    • AristotleAristotle says:
      Thu June 21, 2012 at 8:23 PM MDT

      Not because I don’t trust you (you’ve earned a lifetime pass here for consistently supporting your assertions), but because I’d like to have that for my ammo bin… thanks.

      • VanDammerVanDammer says:
        Thu June 21, 2012 at 9:01 PM MDT

        so I get dibs on being the slower & dumber Ari    

      • ajb says:
        Thu June 21, 2012 at 9:19 PM MDT

        The original comes from a poster at DailyKos: http://www.dailykos.com/story/…

        But Politifact dug a little deeper:

        http://www.politifact.com/trut…

        While congressional Republicans have certainly introduced dozens of bills on social issues and other topics, the  claim that the GOP has focused on issues other than job creation just isn’t supported. The numbers cited in the post include Democratic bills, and the definition of what constitutes a “job creation” bill is open to significant debate.

        But the post’s most important flaw is the contention that Republicans have offered “zero” bills on job creation. This number stems from a methodology that also excludes Obama’s American Jobs Act from the category of “job creation” bills. If  you look at alternative job-related subject headings, the number of bills offered by lawmakers from both parties actually exceeds most of the social-issues listed in the blog post.  We rate this claim Pants on Fire.

        • SSG_Dan says:
          Thu June 21, 2012 at 9:56 PM MDT

          and my source was the Dailykos blog, something I don’t do on a regular basis. No mas.

          I still stand by my assertion that the Republican’t Party has failed in their ’10 campaign promise to be the “JOBS Congress, and I think it’s born out by the same analysis done by OpenCongress.org and Politifact.

          There’s a bunch of bills that have a tertiary “goal” of job creation, but not a single damn piece of legislation who’s sole purpose is to create jobs.  

        • JADoddjadodd says:
          Fri June 22, 2012 at 3:26 PM MDT

          As any follower of The Rachel Madow Show knows, Politifact’s credibility has come under significant challenge recently.  They rated the assertion that  the Ryan budget would end Medicare as false.  We all know that it would.  If you go to Madow’s website, you can see this and the other controversies that she has covered and how Politidact has lost its credibility as an independent fact checker.

    • VanDammerVanDammer says:
      Thu June 21, 2012 at 8:58 PM MDT

      not questioning the validity but would like to look at the source myself — care to share?

  5. Sir RobinSir Robin says:
    Thu June 21, 2012 at 7:56 PM MDT

    Are you friggin kidding me?! This lady is clueless.

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