Thursday Open Thread

“Kindness is in our power, even when fondness is not.”

–Samuel Johnson

54 Community Comments, Facebook Comments

  1. Duke Coxdukeco1 says:

    Anyone know what ever happened to Libertad? Has he left us forever…or just on hiatus?

    It is nice not to have to scroll past six of his cut and paste gems on every open thread.

    Still, I miss having him to beat up(figuratively, of course). At least we still have ol’ Nockwurst around.

  2. Sir RobinSir Robin says:

    Denver metro home values are expected to rise by $21.4 billion this year and U.S. homes nationwide are expected to gain more than $1.3 trillion in value in 2012, according to an analysis by Zillow Real Estate Market Reports.

    A report released Thursday, said that this is the first annual gain in more than five years and the largest since 2005.

  3. dwyer says:

    Okay.  I don’t like what is going on in Washington..I think Boehner is the political equivalent of a cock teaser…..keeps skipping away from commitment at the last possible minute.  I think that one of two things is going on…

    1) He absolutely does not control his caucus and cannot get the votes for anything…

    2) There is some kind of behind the scenes deal with the President that will allow a plan to go through that somehow is face saving for the Speaker.

    I will also repeat that the Obama for America is a very strong national organization that is limited in its power to electing Obama.  The downsize is that when Obama asks for his “base” to wage a campaign in their home districts to support his efforts at avoiding the cliff, they cannot deliver.  

  4. Gray in Mountains says:

    Once again, last night on CNN, Piers Morgan repeatedly confused, and was never corrected, automatic with semi-automatic. He claimed that a semi AR could fire 4-6 rounds a second and up to 100 rounds a minute. Obviously, if it is 4-6 rounds/sec then it would be 240-360 rounds/minute. But, it is simply not true.

    If terms are not clearly defined then something most of us like may pass but within a year or 2 the NRA will be pushing back with fact, real facts, and truth. Then the public support will lessen and repeal will be likely.

    I warn, “semi-automatic” is not the term we want to use. I know that Udall, Manchin and several others know the difference.  

  5. Gray in Mountains says:

    that will only allow the owner to operate a firearm. It would be attacked as being too expensive for sure and may be difficult if, as I frequently do, one is sharing guns at the range. But, if it could be installed in a manner that it had to be turned on and off by the owner it could be valuable. But, I think Lanza was crazy enough to cut his mom’s hand off and take it with him

  6. dwyer says:

    Boehner did not have the votes to pass Plan B.

    So now what?

  7. Gray in Mountains says:

    Though the NRA is largely silent they have a lot of angry members. We may see a lot of folks, ala Tea Baggers, going to DC and packing heat to protest that their constitutional right is being infringed

  8. Gray in Mountains says:

    Though the NRA is largely silent they have a lot of angry members. We may see a lot of folks, ala Tea Baggers, going to DC and packing heat to protest that their constitutional right is being infringed

  9. Gray in Mountains says:

    growth is up for 3rd quarter. Over 3% annually

  10. MADCO says:

    perhaps I could recruit a new rightie or two.  Not ideologically mad or blinded …just hard R.

    Perhaps two. One who could be here most of the time.


  11. DavidThi808DavidThi808 says:

    We could try to make the conversation more professional and respect the person even when we don’t respect the opinion.

  12. Diogenesdemar says:

    It’s now on your head, DC.  

    I could have waited until at least after Valentine’s Day . . .

    . . . 2037


  13. I tried doing that with Fladen the other day…

    I think a lot of the problem is, we’d need to recruit a fleet of them in order to make them feel less ganged up on….

  14. VoyageurVoyageur says:

    We could try to make the conversation more professional and respect the person even when we don’t respect the opinion.


  15. AristotleAristotle says:

    It’s a two way street, you know.

  16. GalapagoLarryGalapagoLarry says:

    I’m outa here.

  17. Libertad says:

    This is a public service announcement to Democrats and others. This accused child rapist and Democratic political operative, once reported to have operated north and east of downtown, has made a lower bond and been released.

    Additionally note that two more victims have come forward, bring Costello’s total accused rapes to five (5). It’s anyone’s guess if Costello is accused of additional child rapes.

    Late last month, we told you about William Costello, charged with being a serial rapist after his DNA scored strikes on three previous sex assaults; see our original coverage below. Since then, he’s been linked to two more crimes, yet his bond was actually lowered — and he’s since been released, prompting frustration for the Denver District Attorney’s Office. Details below.

    As we reported, Costello was arrested this past June for allegedly attacking a man at a grocery store who asked if he’d sign a petition. Afterward, a DNA sample was taken and run through the system — and it registered three matches.


    In the wake of Costello’s arrest, the Denver Post learned that he was a successful real estate broker with a reputation as a good father and ties to a number of powerful and influential Democrats in the state, including former Colorado Governor Dick Lamm.

    Did powerful pals help Costello gain his freedom, at least temporarily? Well, last week, according to Denver DA’s office spokeswoman Lynn Kimbrough, corresponding via e-mail, his bond was lowered from $200,000 to $150,000 despite objections from the prosecutor on the case. He subsequently paid this amount and was released.

    Kimbrough also confirms that “two other people came forward with information” that connects him to another pair of cases, bringing the total in which he’s suspected to five.

    Costello’s next court appearance will be a preliminary hearing slated for 8:30 a.m. on January 30. In the meantime, though, he’s no longer behind bars.

    Maybe one of you more advance bloggers could post his photo below?  

  18. Duke Coxdukeco1 says:

    It’s time to change your sig line…don’t you think?

  19. DaftPunkDaftPunk says:

    Does he deserve to be raped?

  20. BlueCat says:

    from total gloom and doom is over.

    Pretty sure both things you posit about poor old Boehner are true.

    As for your remark about OFA, public support for Obama’s policies v the GOP policies really isn’t the problem right now, judging from all polls and the dozens of e-mail petitions, urges to write and call etc. from all kinds of sources. The public support is there for the wealthy paying more in taxes, not raising the age for medicare, sensible gun control, you name it.

    The problem is the GOP’s position between a rock and a hard place that makes it impossible for them to say yes to anything Obama in spite of all the polls because of the base monster they’ve created and can’t control.

    You can go ahead and blame that on OFA if you want. Did OFA run over your puppy or something?

  21. If “Plan B” makes it through the House, it will be with the barest of majorities. The right wing is pushing back and trying to get House members to vote against it. It’s supposed to come up with a vote this afternoon; if that vote is cancelled (or, worse for Boehner, fails), you’ll know just how far Republicans are willing to compromise: not at all.

    At that point it’s over the cliff and Thank God for it, because it’s the only way we’ll get Republicans to do actual negotiating.

  22. If you’re good, and you don’t care much about what you’re hitting. ( pretty much confirms this rate.)

    The Sandy Hook shooter did all of his carnage in 4 minutes (240 seconds) according to some teacher accounts, killing 26 with multiple (4-15) shots each. That’s 9 seconds per target, perhaps one round per second. And that’s including aiming and moving between rooms.

    The advantage of smaller clip sizes here becomes obvious; if it takes a second or three to switch out clips, plus a second or three to re-aim after dropping the barrel of your weapon…

  23. parsingreality says:

    I mean, how hard is it to differentiate automatic from semi-automatic?  Even I know that one, and I’ve owned neither.  

    No wonder we can’t have intelligent discourse when we don’t even know what the hell we are talking about.  

  24. CaninesCanines says:

    I think Libertad’s post ought to have been a “reply” to yours above.

  25. dwyer says:

    That is a first.

    Let me elaborate on OFA.  The Republican strength is in the states and that is where their political organizations are, dominated in certain key districts by the Tea Party.

    The Tea Party  can leverage the vote of House Republicans by threatening them with a primary opponent. National polls and national social media campaigns do not impact those votes; only pressure in their district will cause them to reconsider their negative votes on the President’s plan.  Despite the President’s repeated call asking constituents to contact their congress people, the infrastructure to pressure the Republicans is not there.  One reason is because OFA is a national organization, not a locally based one.

    Now, I still think that Coffman is vulnerable.  We are not in his District, but we did work on Miklosi’s campaign….if there is any kind of campaIgn to pressure Coffman, we are not included…and we would have done leg work.

    So how do Democrats get enough Republicans in the House to vote for a fiscal bill that Obama will sign?

    That is the question I ask.

  26. dwyer says:

    I disagree with the idea that if we go over the so-called cliff, that the Republicans will negotiate.  The only votes that need to be changed are in the Tea Party Districts and those other Districts where Republican congresspeople think that they would be vulnerable to a Tea Party primary challenge.

    If we go over the “fiscal cliff,” then it will be a strategic victory for those Republicans, IN THEIR DISTRICTS or with the POWER BASE SUPPORTING THEM FINANCIALLY IN THEIR DISTRICTS.  Why would they give up a winning position?

    What happens in the rest of the Congressional Districts (read: The country as a whole) DOES NOT COUNT.

    So my question remains, what can the Democrats do?

  27. Go over the cliff and negotiate back to the middle-class tax cuts and whatever compromises we can work out.

  28. DavidThi808DavidThi808 says:

    Obama is setting the Republicans up to fail? Or more to the point, offering them a decent deal and leaving them on their own to make it happen. And if it fails, it’s all their fault.

    Yes the people in far right districts et re-elected. But the ones in more moderate districts now face a Democrat that can beat them. And with that goes control of the House.

    Don’t know if that’s what’s happening, but its the approach I would take.

  29. Taxes go up if we head over the cliff. Social programs are largely untouched by it. Military spending is cut.

    If there’s a Tea Party rep in a district, we won’t be winning that district. Letting Plan B fail is fine by me; give the TP a win on that, and then they lose on the cliff, because they’ll be blamed for going over it.

  30. parsingreality says:

    Come January 5th (??) Dems gain eight in the House, five in the Senate.  This is the biggest reason Boner and Fox Lies are ramped on with things like “cliff” and other nail biters.

    Write new tax policy retroactively that keeps the same rates for Joe and Josephina Sixpack, stick it to the Waltons.

    With Obama running 55% popularity, with Americans presently holding the Pubes accountable for failing to find a solution, there will probably be enough wise House members to see the handwriting on the wall.  They will vote for the new tax bill.

  31. BlueCat says:

    Exactly. What kind of “infrastructure” at any level is going to cause a CD that elects Tea Party members to elect someone more moderate? What kind of “infrastructure” is going to get a Tea Party rep to say yes to anything Obama? Infrastructure isn’t a magic word.

    As for Miklosi, he never had much of a chance to begin with, regardless of any amount local leg work. That’s not how well established incumbents get dislodged. It takes tons of national money which only gets invested where the odds are a lot more favorable.

    Look at how Warren took back Ted’s Senate seat.  Yeah she worked her butt off and so did the local “infrastructure” but without the obscene amounts of national money, it just doesn’t happen.

    I’m with you PR. It may well be that the best way to go is over the cliff. There is no scenario, after all, where the GOP is going to hold hands and sing with Obama. Not with any amount of abracadabra “infrastructure”.

  32. BlueCat says:

    in a couple of places is the fact that Lanza was also incapable of feeling physical or emotional pain. This constitutes a very serious disability. When he was in school the concern was to protect him from being hurt because of this insensitivity to physical pain or being hurt by bullies because of his general weirdness. As far as suffering emotional anguish from being teased, this was apparently beyond his capabilities.

    It’s hard to imagine what kind of therapy can reach someone so deficient in the ability to feel and therefore be influenced by…. what? How is any level of empathy possible for someone with such a profound inability to feel? What would make living breathing children any different from targets in video games to such a person? What would make your own mother any different?  

  33. dwyer says:

    So here is where we stand:

    You say, go over the cliff and then the Republicans will have to negotiate a middle-class tax.

    I say, I don’t think the tea party repubs will be motivated to negotiate if we go over the cliff.

    Now, I am not predicting that this is what is going to happen.  This is how I see things, now.

    I will be watching the Republicans…not the Democrats…because I think the dems have done all they can do.

    I want to see how this works out.

  34. GalapagoLarryGalapagoLarry says:


    Then what happens depends on who the Speaker is after Jan.3. If Boehner hangs on, he’s liable to be so pissed about tonight he dumps the “Hastert rule”, jettisons his right wing and starts dealing with Pilosi for Dem. support on a deal that can be hammered out in good faith. I think Dem chances of a good deal are better early in the new year.

  35. VoyageurVoyageur says:

    The point is after Jan. 1, everybody’s taxes go up.   At that point, you need a majority in both chambers to lower some of them.   Repubs will have no choice but to go along.   Same is true of the defense cuts.  

  36. Diogenesdemar says:

    enough with this “fiscal cliff” nonsense . . .

    The expiration of some piece, or pieces, of legislation is not the freakin’ apocalypse . . .

    Likewise with the effective date of some piece, or pieces, of new legislation.

    The Perfect Storm is a movie.

    Legislation, like individual people, comes and goes.  Take a week’s rest and let Wolfe Blitzer do the hand wringing for you . . . that’s what we’re paying him for.

    In the meantime, three words of advice —




  37. BlueCat says:

    which is understandable since Miklosi never had more than a long to no shot chance in the first place. It was more to force the GOP to spend more money on Coffman than with any expectation of winning. I do live in CD6. You don’t know what you’re talking about.  

  38. Gray in Mountains says:

    but it may be because I am very deliberate

  39. DavidThi808DavidThi808 says:

    The one who offers more respect? Or the one that says only if you do so first?

  40. DavidThi808DavidThi808 says:

    We’ve found over the last 2 months more and more cases of potential sales where the project has been put on hold. It was going well but I think the final numbers for November/December will be down a bit.

  41. harrydobyharrydoby says:

    … much less his caucus.

    Maybe in January, there will be a new Red Dog caucus comprised of the few remaining semi-moderate Republicans in the House.

    Pickup a dozen or so swing votes, and we have a passable majority on rational compromise.

    It’ll have to do until we get another crack at elections in ’14.

  42. BlueCat says:

    completely unable to function as a participant in our system of government.

    This makes perfect sense when you consider how often  all good GOPers expresses hatred for government and the conviction that government is pretty much useless for anything but maintaining a military. If they didn’t do a really lousy job they would be making liars of themselves.

    It makes sense when you have people being elected to a legislative body that can only function via real, significant compromise who then proclaim that they will absolutely, positively not compromise on any core principles and consider pretty much everything of any significance a core principal.

    The GOP may have gerrymandered their way to House dominance and but they have made the House a sick joke. With their constant use of the filibuster they have made the Senate a sick joke. The monster they created is destroying the American way of government.  One can only hope it destroys the GOP  before the GOP destroys the whole country.

  43. RedGreenRedGreen says:

    get an invite to the arks … er, never mind. Nice knowing ya, MADCO!

  44. MADCO says:

    The wanted pairs – there’s only one of me.

    I keep hoping for a rapturous end time event – heaven is earth without all the other idiots.

  45. AristotleAristotle says:

    That you give respect to those who don’t earn it?

    Respect isn’t a comparison game, where you look at two people and say “This one deserves it and that one doesn’t.” It’s given on a case by case basis.

  46. DavidThi808DavidThi808 says:

    Maybe the way to phrase it is act professional? I’m trying to find a way to say that we should endeavor to not be the one who leads the degradation of the conversation.

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