Wednesday Open Thread

30
  by: Colorado Pols Wed January 2, 2013 at 4:21 PM MDT

“I would rather fail in a cause that will ultimately triumph than to triumph in a cause that will ultimately fail.”

–Woodrow T. Wilson


Full story: Wednesday Open Thread

30 Community Comments, Facebook Comments

  2. GalapagoLarryGalapagoLarry says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 7:08 AM MDT

    To continue that little education funding thread that developed here the other day, the Lobato v. Colorado case will hit the Supreme court this spring.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/…

    Even if Lobato wins,

    …courts typically don’t specify how states must raise additional money for schools, which could present problems if they mandate increases in tax-averse Colorado and Texas. Colorado’s constitution includes a “Taxpayer Bill of Rights” that limits budget growth.

    The different paths taken by Wyoming and Kansas, where courts ruled against the state, illustrate the funding challenge.

    Obviously Colorado districts aren’t the only ones struggling to keep their noses above water. Tactics vary around the country, but going to court on constitutional grounds (as in Colorado) is common.

    Another pathway to court has been through testing results as proof of inadequacy.

    …trying to prove the inadequacy of school funding through test results could provide perverse incentives for states to water down standards.

    “One way to make education cost less is to lower the goals of education…”

    Glad we didn’t try that.

  3. Phoenix RisingPhoenix Rising says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 7:20 AM MDT

    Lowering the debt of the U.S. to “responsible” levels (in their opinion), or cutting taxes?

    Cutting taxes hasn’t worked so well for our debt, and it seems like any long-term solution to our budget problem must include paying down the debt. Debt service is an increasing part of our budget, and it slows down economic growth by reducing the effectiveness of government. Reducing government services also slows economic growth.

    I personally find that increased wages made it easier to pay down my debts than reducing my normal spending. I’ve paid more debt since switching jobs than I’ve paid in a long time – and I’ve been more of a contributor to the local economy, too. Before the increase, paying down my debts often meant putting off home maintenance or eating stuff that wasn’t as good for my health…

    Right now we have crumbling infrastructure and are putting off some things that would be good investments for the country; we have some bloated expenses, but fixing them won’t be enough to pay down the debt. We could cut stuff out, but cutting things would leave gaps that our country needs and private markets haven’t or can’t adequately fill. So we’re back to revenue… Under the last Clinton budgets we were paying down the debt – so what’s so horrible about using the higher tax rates (under which we were all doing Just Fine, Thank You) to pay down our debt before reducing taxes?

    What can we do for our country?

  4. ClubTwittyClubTwitty says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 7:33 AM MDT

    No thanks to Reps. Scott Tipton, Coffman, and Lamebrain, and Gradner

  5. Phoenix RisingPhoenix Rising says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 10:55 AM MDT

    Republicans are going around saying that now that the tax issue is off the table, they have a better hand during the sequester/debt ceiling negotiations. But do they?

    Democrats no longer have to worry (for a year) about unemployment, the doc fix, or a number of useful business tax credits. They don’t have to worry (for 5 years) about EITC and other tax credits that help the poor.

    If Democrats do nothing in 2 months, the sequester takes effect, and Defense spending takes the biggest hit while social programs are protected.

    Aside from the debt ceiling – which Obama is starting to talk about using the right language (paying bills Congress has already approved) – Republicans have little leverage in the upcoming budget talks.

  6. Albert J. Nock says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 12:42 PM MDT

    I must have died and went to hell because this fiscal cliff talk and the final outcome sure seems like hell.

    For starters, what kind of idiots procrastinate till the very last second? Also why conduct business when everyone is on Holiday and or drunk at 2 in the morning ?

    Well anyways, read these links to learn just how silly this cliff is/was.

    Full Text (157 pages!)

    http://www.businessinsider.com…

    Commentary

    http://www.themoneyillusion.co…

    http://www.businessinsider.com…

     

  8. Phoenix RisingPhoenix Rising says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 2:43 PM MDT

    Lots of rumors flying about right now that Speaker Boehner will announce his resignation as Speaker tonight.

    It is reported that some 20 Republicans have signed on opposing Boehner. (They will have only a 17 seat majority in the new Congress, and 20 defections leaves Boehner short of a majority vote…)

    This on Martin Bashir’s show, with Ron Meyer of the American Majority Institute as guest.

  10. GalapagoLarryGalapagoLarry says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 7:09 AM MDT

    You need more junk.

  11. Phoenix RisingPhoenix Rising says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 7:26 AM MDT

    There’s nothing saying that we won’t go the “lower the goals of education” route, though it’s less likely with the Democratic legislature. I was afraid Republicans would put that up on the block the minute Lobato was decided at the local court level.

    The fun part of Lobato is that the state constitution puts the onus on education funding directly on the state. IMHO the responsible thing to do would be to rebalance funding so that the state pays for enough teachers and equipment in each district to reach the education goals in that district.

  14. ClubTwittyClubTwitty says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 7:49 AM MDT

    I believe more in the animal spirits than the wise invisible hand.  Still, since it is the Teanuts in Congress that claim the Free Market is all knowing I await the spinning on why they all voted ‘against’ it…

  15. dwyer says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 8:13 AM MDT

    Am I right or am I missing something?

  16. Phoenix RisingPhoenix Rising says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 10:39 AM MDT

    The payroll tax holiday was supposedly offset by sending money from the General Fund into the SSDI trust fund (or so I seem to recall). Since, as Voyageur will be quick to point out, it’s all fungible in the end, I’m not sure what it really does.

    If I’m wrong and the lower tax receipts weren’t offset by expenditures from the General Fund, then yes, it will be a major adjustment from the Social Security trust fund board pushing out the date when it is projected that SSDI tax receipts won’t keep up with payments and the trust fund will be exhausted.

    How TP conservatives will see this change, I’m not sure.

  17. Phoenix RisingPhoenix Rising says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 10:48 AM MDT

    What would help the most to keep SSDI and other social safety net programs solvent in the long term would be for the economy to recover. SSDI has had increasing problems because payroll tax receipts have been down and interest rates on bonds have been almost non-existent in the past few years. Reversing this trend by getting people employed and interest rates back into “sane” territory would do much to fix the “problems” we have right now. That would be called “normal” if we were to look at long-term economic planning models rather than succumbing to the panic of the moment.

  19. VoyageurVoyageur says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 1:05 PM MDT

    For starters, what kind of idiots procrastinate till the very last second?

     But I just can’t seem to find time to write a witty reply just not.  Maybe in a couple of months;-)

  20. GalapagoLarryGalapagoLarry says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 6:40 PM MDT

    Hmm, maybe the same kind of idiot that waits until Jan. 2 to realize how silly it was?

  21. MADCO says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 4:20 PM MDT

    or the front of a simple t-shirt?

    Then it doesn’t matter.

    Unless- somehow, KIm & Kanye’s baby can be mixed in.

  22. ClubTwittyClubTwitty says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 4:30 PM MDT

    but people keep tail gating me!

  24. VoyageurVoyageur says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 4:58 PM MDT

    boehner replaced by a right-wing fruitcake like Cantor or Ryan would be change for the worse.

  25. GalapagoLarryGalapagoLarry says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 6:45 PM MDT

    that creep Cantor gets put front and center.

    Frankly, unless Boehner resigns, I think the crackpots will keep Boehner out front to take the shots. All they want is to snipe and destroy. They’d be scared shitless to actually assume responsibility.

  26. Phoenix RisingPhoenix Rising says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 7:29 PM MDT

    Boehner says he won’t be doing secret deals with Obama any more. Future bills will go through more traditional House or Senate origination procedures. Frankly, this is probably a win for Democrats, because it will be Republicans in the House proposing cuts, not some offer by Obama. And I wonder based on his apparently rocky relations with his own caucus if this isn’t intended as backdoor sabotage against the extremists.

    Of course, that assumes Boehner will be in charge of deciding that kind of stuff come tomorrow.

  27. Phoenix RisingPhoenix Rising says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 5:07 PM MDT

    Boehner’s ability to act on this bill was probably a one-time shot in special circumstances.

    I can’t think of anything else he’s done and actually gotten past his crazy caucus members, who seem more than happy to remove him if he falls out of step.

    He’s tried, and I think if his fortunes weren’t tied to the wingnutty wing of the GOP he’d be a pragmatic conservative. Unfortunately for all of us, “pragmatic” right now in Boehner’s world means pandering to the radical reactionary right.

  28. MADCO says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 6:52 PM MDT

    But then Cantor gets to “deal” with the debt ceiling, Fiscal Cliff II (sequestration and CR), guns, Dream Act and whatever else.

    Would love to have him out front for any/all.

    After all 2014 mid-terms are practically upon us.  

  30. ClubTwittyClubTwitty says:
    Wed January 2, 2013 at 7:56 PM MDT

    I think is that Boehner’s war is no longer with Obama.  

    Its TeaNutz heads that he is after, because he knows now his party is at stake (he is resigned to being either impotent as a Speaker or ousted forthright, I predict the latter).  

    I love the smell of GOP internecine warfare in the morning!  

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