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November 21, 2009 04:07 PM UTC

Weekend Open Thread

  • 83 Comments
  • by: Colorado Pols

“Politics has become so expensive that it takes a lot of money even to be defeated.”

–Will Rogers

Comments

83 thoughts on “Weekend Open Thread

  1. http://www.denverpost.com/news

    The Denver Police Department arrested 32 men and juvenile boys after a months-long undercover investigation into what police said were racially motivated assaults and robberies in downtown Denver, including the LoDo entertainment district.

    A task force composed of Denver police, the FBI and the Denver district attorney’s office investigated 26 incidents in which groups of black males verbally harassed, assaulted and at times robbed white or Latino males, according to Denver Police Chief Gerry Whitman.

    All of the suspects are young black males, most of whom told police they were associated with either the Rollin’ 60s Crips gang or the Black Gangster Disciples gang.

    They are charged with varying counts of bias-motivated assault and, in some cases, robbery – all felony crimes.

    Glad they took these guys off the streets – and glad they’re facing hate crime charges too.

    1. But I sure miss you ladies and gentlemen.

      I have it on good authority that Bob had a one-year noncompete clause when he left the Post and it is now expired.  Maybe we’ll hear from him soon.

    1. ….for introducing the world to Sarah, Queen of the Teabaggers!  

        I can’t say I’m all that surprised.  He’s a Dede Scozzafava in waiting.

  2. from the Denver Post

    A study published in the Journal of Negro Education concluded that urban debate helps students in low-performing schools, raising their chances of high school graduation, their literacy scores and their readiness to attend college.

    There is a ton of anecdotal evidence that for whatever reason, participating in debate significantly increases the odds of a poor kid graduating and going to college. LBJ ran his school’s debate team back when he was a school teacher and saw these results.

    Kudos to the people who brought this in to DPS.

    1. DPS has had debate for a million years….

      I was on a high school debate team…albeit the B team….

      debate is great.

      That’s is why I am so damm scared about the power of talk radio….the first rule you learn in debate is to control the terms…the team which defines the terms usually wins…talk radio is defining the terms…..brilliantly…

      talk radio has every rational person on the defensive REACTING…As a patriot, I fear for my country….but I can’t help but admire the strategy….as an old, old high school debater…

      1. Sirota seems to do very well in terms of getting guests, projecting his message and terms of debate.  I expect he’ll go national at some point or clear channel will book he and Tancredo for a Caplis-Silverman style show.

        Since Jay left the scene at 710 or 760 that station has improved, they seem to have better advertisers paying for promotion.  

        Why liberal radio has never achieved sustainable success is a mystery.  

        Maybe you all have some opinions as to why success has never been sustainable?

        ps it seems like Rosen, Rush, Beck, Caplis-Silverman are just killing it!

        1. There are clearly a lot of people on the right who want to spend time listening to some blowhard tell them why their world is not the way it should be. On the left there doesn’t seem to be much demand for that.

          On the flip side, the left does clearly find the two-way communication of the web a lot more interesting and that’s why the left dominates the web.

        2. 760 has the broadcast range of a small bullhorn…..that is the progressive station…..most people in metro denver can’t get it, let alone the rest of the state….and it only has six hours of local programing….if you count the afternoon show which I believe comes out of LA.    There is no parity in terms of broadcast range…

          Now, what right wing radio says is it is all about revenue and ratings and the market makes the decision as to what will be on the public airwaves and I say bullshit.  When gigiantic corporations pay for a radio license, they are under no obligation to show a profit or to only put on shows which have high ratings..

          I believe that the right wing shows are propaganda for the republican party which is always more favorable to corporations and business in general…..so I argue that the people holding the licenses and those buying ads want to persuade people to vote republican and the programs are designed to promote that cause…

          You want weather or traffic in Colorado and you are in your car, chances are all you can dial up is right wing radio…

          1. You want weather or traffic in Colorado and you are in your car, chances are all you can dial up is right wing radio…

            Just for one example, you mention weather and my response is why would anyone turn to radio when you have an iPhone. More and more what people get from radio they will get from the web (via their phone).

            Yes those that want to hear Rush will tune him in. But they should be able to get the entertainment they want. But the rest will leave radio. Radio is facing the same problem newspapers are facing – it’s going away. For radio the killer is the iPhone, Android, etc.

            1. I am not kidding, DT, I don’t have one and I don’t know how it would work.  Why is this significant….demographics….I am in the age group which listens to talk radio, didn’t vote for Obama, and does vote.  And, thanks to government run health care, we are going to live a long time…..

              1. The cellphone towers were the first to go.

                Real radio, which was transmitted from towers elsewhere–many of them–kept working.

                Radio.  Anytime, anywhere.

                Full disclosure:  I’m a ham.  They will NEVER shut down our network, which is transmitted from thousands of houses all over every region.

                If you want to rely on your Iphone, God help you.  Because Steve Jobs sure as shit won’t.

                1. That’s just super. I wish everyone had an iPhone. That’s probably the biggest difference between the Israelis and the Palestinians, and once they sort it all out, we’ll all be in love like we should have always been.

                  Except how the fuck do you use an iPhone while you’re driving? Mom or otherwise?

                  1. I am currently using an HTC Touch Pro. Nice, but a bit heavy.  It has Sprint Navigation that is very good. Along with a lot of other great apps.  Someday in the future HTC will need to change it’s voice creation program – currently it has a Korean accent.  I’ve talked to others who own one and they said the same for theirs.

                    Next year I do not konw what the replacement for this phone will be. Whatever it is it will be a smartphone.  Evolution happens in electronics all the time.

            1. Clear Channel….my dear….Clear Channel….why don’t they want to”expand in open spectrum?”  If they wanted to be fair and balanced they would put Sirota on with Rosen or after Rosen…or put one of the other national  so-called progressive on 850 AM…the blowtorch of the Rockies…which reaches all of Colorado and 38 other states….

              Why don’t they???  You tell me.

    2. Yep, David.  This poor farm boy received his college scholarship because of what he was able to accomplish in high school debate.  But more than anything else, I believe debate prepares you for the analytical skills needed all throughout adulthood.  You have to prepare for both sides of an issue in high school debate competitions.  It develops so many skills, public speaking, research methods, healthy skepticism, self-confidence, awareness of logic fallacies, the psychology of human motivation, deductive and inductive reasoning and all the associated analytical skills needed in so much of life. And once you have developed those skills and the neuron connections in your youth, they are there for a lifetime.

      I had friends and a couple of coaches pissed at me in high school because I dropped sports, my junior year, in favor of concentrating on forensics competitions.  I’ve never regretted it.

      I read a psychology study, years ago, that pointed out that a large percentage of the prison population, sentenced for violent crimes, had very poor communication and analytical skills. The study showed that the inability to properly express their selves was a huge contributing factor in their violence and subsequent incarceration.

      Now, obviously, you do not have to be the captain of your high school or college debate team to develop these skills.  But if our schools are there to prepare our youth for the challenges of the future, kids should take advantage of the highly valuable experiences debate provides.

      Oh…and get a clue, Libby. Talk radio is not debate when you are just advocating one side of an issue.  Hell, Limpbough even screens his calls to make sure there is not an intelligent person on the other end wanting to engage in sane analysis.  

      1. But I think there is another key point – they find a lot of kids step up to the challenges in debate. There are a lot of ways you can teach these skills. This is one of the few where it seems to suck kids in and they put in the effort.

        I’d love to see this build. And I hope more kids follow your lead and put this above sports. Wouldn’t it be cool to see the state debate finals televised…

  3. http://www.bea.gov/newsrelease


    Real gross domestic product — the output of goods and services produced by labor and property located in the United States — increased at an annual rate of 3.5 percent in the third quarter of 2009, (that is, from the second quarter to the third quarter), according to the “advance” estimate released by the Bureau of Economic Analysis.  In the second quarter, real GDP decreased 0.7 percent.

    The Bureau emphasized that the third-quarter advance estimate released today [102909] is based on source data that are incomplete or subject to further revision by the source agency (see the box on page 5).  The “second” estimate for the third quarter, based on more complete data, will be released on November 24, 2009.

    Anyone want to bet it’ll be lower then 3.0, anyone wanna bet its really lowered?

    If revised number is above 3.01 then I don’t post here for 2 weeks, if at or below 3.0 you don’t post for 2 weeks.

    1. We’ll know the answer 11/25/09.

      Come on redstate, Ralphie!!  I’ll make a bet for you two …. if above 3.1 I won’t post for 3 weeks, if at 3.1 or below both of you don’t post for 3 weeks.  We’ll know the answer 11/25/09 and that day will begin the 3 week period.

      The loser(s) will be able to make a single post that day to concede.

        1. I have another bet for you Dan … that is, if redstate and Ralphie strap on their panties and man up to the bet above.  I they man up I put forward an even more enticing bet.

          dwyer still has yet to confirm … hum redstate and Ralphie must be waiting for dwyer to confirm 1st.

          Come on what are you chickens concerned about … all the news from Ritter, CNN, Geithner, CNBC, Obama, etc has been rosy.  What’s up, don’t trust your leaders, don’t you trust the stimulus?

      1. Set one:

        If revised number is above 3.01 then I don’t post here for 2 weeks, if at or below 3.0 you don’t post for 2 weeks.

        Set two:

        if above 3.1 I won’t post for 3 weeks, if at 3.1 or below both of you don’t post for 3 weeks.

        Your math is a little funky.

        1. to dwyer:

          If revised number is above 3.0 then I don’t post here for 2 weeks, if at or below 3.0 you don’t post for 2 weeks.

          to redstate and Ralphie:

          If above 3.1 I won’t post for 3 weeks, if at 3.1 or below both of you don’t post for 3 weeks. They both need to accept this bet.

          to Dan:

          I’ll have an even better bet for you…much more enticing 😉

          1. ….on any subject posted anywhere on this website.

            Why? Because YOU still never answered my challenge about economic recovery in the US without gov’t intervention, post Free Banking Era.

            This labels you to be the whiney welcher you are, and offering to maybe bet with you on something you MIGHT man up to doesn’t entice me at all.

            Go back online and try and get the Epic Axe for your World of Warcraft character.

        1. Can I choose the two weeks I go dark……I can’t not be blogging on this issue…

          Or, did you figure out that is what the Senate was going to do…and played us for fools??  If so, well done.

          1. your off the hook.

            Next week when the revised GDP figure comes out and its closer to 2.5 then 3.5, I’ll await all your justifications on why the stimulus has worked.

            1. What the heck is the problem if it gets adjusted in a few days? Happens all the time. It is what happens to preliminary estimates. 2.5 or 4.5, is still better than a negative number.  And it shows the stimulus has been effective in heading off a Bush depression.  

              Why bet on it?  Geeze, you must not making a lot of money from fixing and betting on dodge ball games down at the old folks home, huh?

    1. SEIU isn’t being prosecuted for opening mail is because…

      OBAMA GOT TO THE ATTORNEY GENERAL TOO!

      Everything that doesn’t support my whackjob theory is evidence for my conspiracy theory.

      1. is no justification to let them off the hook.  

        I have to admit the union boss on union boss crime is funny, but at the same time its the workers that are being raped by the system.

  4. When people say that Ken Buck is toast, that Penry had no chance, etc. I’d like to remind you of one little item.

    Half way through the presidential primary McCain ran out of money and his support cratered. All the smart people told him it was over and there was no way back.

    Yet he won the primary. Money isn’t everything.

  5. Let me show you, David T, why the dems are going to lose in 2010 in Colorado…..

    This is how the rightwing integrates their propaganda machine..you will have to admire the technical expertise…

    boyles posts on the KHOW website a video claiming to show

    Obama professing to be a Muslin….it is a cut and paste video…not putting Obama’s  words about “his Muslin faith” in context…then boyles publicizes the video on his radio show…..then Wolf, etc….evidently believing the video and all the birther stuff (which began on the web) posts his billboard demanding Obama reveal his birthcertificate and whether he is a muslin terrorist……the billboard gets a lot of media play…

    Saturday night on KOA, boyles’ producer. (whose name I don’t know) is on and interviews Wolf…who says he believes that Obama is a muslin (obviously from the video posted on the KHOW website) and ties this all into the Fort Hood massacre….people from 38 states call in, SUPPORTING wolf….anyone who tries to confront or question Wofl is cut off ….now the interview with Wolf goes up all over the net…..and media will get copies of the Wolf interview and it will be what is on the talk shows/Sunday…..not the health care victory..

    You will be happy to know that this blog was attacked for decrying the kind of talk radio which “gives permission” to people like Wolf…..the host said, and “we don’t need permission to exercise free speech”….of course, he is absolutely right and I expect to see that phrase on billboards and blasted all over talk radio……all the while, the talk radio power heads will continue to deny real access on those shows to anyone who disagrees …..and further alienating the american public from their president……

    By hey, ” as long as I have my IPhone to keep me warm, what do I care?”   This is a bad day for free speech.

    1. There are people that no matter what Obama does, they will hate him. They can all get as worked up as they want, they still only get one vote each.

      But when they go off on these rants in public – it hurts them. Elections, in this country and in this state, are decided in the middle. This crazy stuff – the talk show, the billboard, turn those groups off.

      What would be bad for Ritter is if those guys kept quiet so the Republicans could all pretend to be reasonable & moderate.

      1. In NJ and VA, the dems LOST the independent vote..In dick Morris’s book “Catastrophe,” he laid out a “take back” strategy for the repubs and said winning governorships in NJ and VA would be the first real step…..he evidently helped engineer that…and was successful…Talk radio was a factor.

        How do you explain the drop in support for Ritter….he has been relentlessly attacked on talk radio and I think that is a factor…

        If you say that the crazy talk turns these moderate groups off… i say prove it.    Our own LB is, of course, the notable exception which proves the rule.

        1. First off, the ’08 election was an apogee for us Dems. We weren’t going to go any higher. And everyone was so relieved to have anyone but Bush.

          Second – it’s the economy. People have forgotten how close we came to a total meltdown. Instead they see jobs continuing to disappear while the big banks book record profits. That is going to seriously harm every single Democrat.

          Ritter’s done the best he can with the situation we have here in Colorado. He has zero ability to turn the economy. And yet his re-election is very dependent on the state of the economy next September.

            1. Evidently Sirota was the first to publicize this and it went national on the “ed show.”…..not to bad for the good guys……..although the broadcast range for 760 is still equal to a tincan and a string….

  6. nearly 20 years after the fact.  One planning commissioner takes lead from Craig Meis–admits he does work for well owners but refuses to recuse himself.

    http://www.postindependent.com

    GLENWOOD SPRINGS, Colorado – Garfield County’s citizen planners this week recommended that a set of natural-gas wells that have been operating without the proper permits for years be granted those permits and allowed to keep operating.

    …The wells, now owned by Williams Production RMT Co., were originally started by Barrett Resources Corp. in 1990, under an agreement between Barrett, Battlement Mesa Partners and Battlement Mesa Realty Partners, according to research by the county planning department.

    One of the pads is now the site of drilling operations, while the other pad is currently limited to production only, although future drilling from the second pad apparently is possible, according to testimony at the P&Z hearing.

    The hearing, which started at 7:15 p.m. and lasted for more than three hours, drew a number of Battlement Mesa residents – members of the Battlement Concerned Citizens group.

    The BCC, according to co-chair Dave Devanney, has been collectively “distressed” by the announcement last summer of plans by Antero Resources to install 10 well pads, with up to 200 wells in all, within the boundaries of the PUD.

    “Our feelings of outrage and frustration were further heightened” by the news of Williams’ 19 years of drilling and pumping without the proper permits. The lack of permits came to light as county staffers were conducting research into the PUD and the extraction of minerals within its boundaries.

    “We see this as a serious failure of the regulatory system,” said Devanney regarding the lapse of 19 years without permits. He urged the county to impose “a significant … monetary penalty” on “both the applicant and the operator” of the wells.

    …Another Battlement Mesa resident, Ron Galterio, termed Williams’ gas drilling to be “illegal operations” that for years were ignored because they were in remote parts of the PUD and not near human habitation. But with growth in the community, he indicated, that would no longer be true.

    …Some issues that came up included a recommendation for a deadline for disposal of pit liners used to prevent leakage from ponds holding various liquids used in the drilling process; and removal of “cuttings,” the soil and other material brought to the surface during drilling.

    Williams attorney Jim Borgel argued for permission to leave half the cuttings in place after completion of the drilling process, which he said had been done in other locations.

    “It’s just mud, it’s just dirt,” said Commissioner John Kuersten, who disclosed early in the meeting that his company does work for Williams but did not recuse himself from the discussion or the vote.

    …”It’s not waste, it’s just a function of the mineral extraction process,” protested Borgel, prompting Commissioner Greg McKennis to retort, “That raises some issues with me. I don’t understand how it can be waste but not waste.”

    The commission, however, concurred with Borgel and recommended that half the cuttings be permitted to remain on the site.

  7. “Between now and 2013, at least $1.3 trillion of financing comes due, of which $160 billion was the result of securitizations. Unfortunately, as a result of the virtual disappearance of the secondary market, the weakened condition of the banks, and the amount of debt already held by insurance companies and pension funds, even under the best of circumstances, less than half of the outstanding debt can be refinanced.”

    TARP funds are being saved for this?  

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