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December 02, 2010 04:48 PM UTC

Thursday Open Thread

  • 109 Comments
  • by: Colorado Pols

“Where doubt is, there truth is–it is her shadow.”

–Ambrose Bierce

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109 thoughts on “Thursday Open Thread”

      1. It’s gonna air at 6 pm and went well

        The debate was over whether American Muslims are doing enough to stop terrorists – I got my points out and was very pleased (however – I was probably too aggressive)

        Anyways – I’ll do my best to all YouTube it – thank you all!

        I always appreciate being on Fox, so I’m thankful for them inviting me

        (lol @ BlueCat and the torture I’m putting her through – sorry!)

        1. Or that better be a kick ass tie.

          He just suggested that the left wants big government so much that we are pushing tax vote to kill the economy so we can swear that government can fix it.

          Like we were the ones saying that a new President should fail when his goals are to shrink unemployment and get the economy back on track.

          I could be watching The Simpsons.

        2. Why doesn’t Bill use his stage to not only speak against terrorism, but also to constantly drive the point that a majority of Muslims agree with him on that point?

          I’m always lost on why people have to loudly oppose something they never supported.  Education is how we’re going to win this particular “war.”  Not by a group saying loudly that white people need not fear them.

        1. go up to View function and click on AdBlock to turn ads off of any site you are on. You just have to copy and paste the address of the site into the bar that pops up when AdBlock is turned on.

          And voila, no more ads.  

              1. secretary of commerce under Nixon, founder of the huge private equity firm Blackstone Group, multi-billionaire, former CEO of Lehman Bros. and one of the co-founders of the Concord coalition (focused on reducing the budget deficit).

                Yes, he’s an R, but I think this guy just hates the US being in so much debt.  I know, going out on a limb by saying theres no ulterior motive, but I am beginning to think that is really his cause.

                An exerpt from WikiPedia:

                He is founding Chairman of the Peterson Institute for International Economics (formerly the Institute for International Economics, renamed in his honour in 2006), and a Trustee of the Committee for Economic Development. He was also Chairman of the Federal Reserve Bank of New York between 2000 and 2004.

                In 2008, Peterson founded the Peter G. Peterson Foundation (PGPF), an organization devoted to spreading public awareness on fiscal sustainability issues related to the national debt, federal deficits, entitlement programs, and tax policies. PGPF distributed the 2008 documentary film I.O.U.S.A., and did outreach to the 2008 presidential candidates.[9]

                Peterson funds The Fiscal Times, a news website that reports on current economic issues, including the federal budget, the growing deficit, entitlements, health care, personal savings, taxation, and the global economy. Fiscal Times contributors and editors include several veteran economics reporters for the New York Times and the Washington Post.

                On August 4, 2010, it was announced that Peter G. Peterson had signed “The Giving Pledge.” He was one of 40 billionaires, led by Bill Gates and Warren Buffett, who agreed to give half their wealth to charity.[10]

                Or he could just own a shit ton of government bonds.  Who knows.

                1. http://www.politico.com/news/s…  

                  He’s a Republican, but doesn’t seem to be any more critical of the Dems than he is of the Republicans.  He notes that the GOP policies since 1994 have contributed to the national debt and that the current “cut spending” chorus doesn’t offer any specifics.  

                  All in all, from what I’ve read, he seems pretty rational and realistic.

                  1. why all of a sudden? Why when we’re still in the middle of fighting our way out of the worst economic crisis in more than half a century (and we’re STILL not out of the woods yet)? Why not when GWB was running up his massive deficits just to pay for tax cuts for the already wealthy and two unfunded wars? And why no emphasis on a fairer (read more progressive) tax structure? The recommendations for the deficit reduction committee have all the burden placed on the middle and working classes and retirees, with no burden on the wealthy.

                    Have we really become a one party society? The Dems and the Reps seem to march in lock step these days on economic fairness issues (neither believes in it). Obama seems not only willing but eager to cave into the Rs on extending ALL the Bush era tax cuts, no matter the greater long term harm to fiscal policy. What is really happening here? So he can say “See? I got unemployment benefits extended!” Caving in to blackmail to do the right thing is a wrong thing!

      1. it’s a matter of placement. Put anything you want at the top, bottom, and margins, but please don’t be so obnoxious as to place it right in the middle where I’m looking for the actual content.

    6. But I’m too lazy to find the original post with the links. Conveniently, Adam Schrager did a truth test on it last night:

      http://www.9news.com/news/poli…

      Basically the ads are trying to raise awareness among low information voters that the debt is a huge problem, and we need to do something about it. Contrary to some of the snarky comments related to these admittedly stupid ads, the intent behind them is actually good IMO. Check out the solutions page on the Peter G. Peterson Foundation web site. What they’re proposing is not “more services, lower taxes” as David suggested. As far as I can tell, what they’re suggesting could hardly be called reactionary.

      I agree that ads in the middle of the Front Page are annoying, but that’s the story behind them.

      1. He didn’t say Peterson is proposing “more services, lower taxes.”  He said, accurately, that the cartoon character, Hugh Jidette, is running on that contradictory platform.  In short, David was engaging in irony.

        1. your power of being able to tell the difference between the irony and the reality.

          At any rate, I saw people saying they didn’t understand the ads, and since I shared in their befuddlement when they first popped up, I thought I’d inform everybody.

          1. David said he’d vote for the mythological candidate, arguing “what’s not to like” about lower taxes and better services.  That’s a joke, son.  He didn’t impute such contradictory stances to the actual Peterson website statements.

          2. irony impaired. In any case, if you look at the triggers used in the ad it’s in line with the whole Dems want to burden your poor little children message which is straight out of the rightie spin machine.  I’m betting the people paying for this ad campaign intend that you imagine Hugh to be a Dem or an R beltway sell out, not true to what they insist are the only true conservative values. Like burdening your children with a hot polluted planet.

                  1. business and personal related distractions I should just quietly observe for a while! I’ll stick with my glass of red wine in the evening for medicinal purposes. No more comments until at least Monday!  

      2. Like most things today, you shouldn’t judge a book by it’s cover, and you shouldn’t judge an organization’s ultimate goals by their name or their mission statement.

        The Peter G. Petersen foundation is no John Birch society, but neither is it as benign nor benevolent as it states it is.  The foundation is pretty mainstream Republican (i.e., right wing) and the positions that they advocate for mostly are the same ones as the Kochs, Murdoch, Boehner, et al.  They do pay some lip service to revenue issues, but they strongly advocate for cuts to those things benefitting the middle and lower classes.

        2. Did you even read that? It’s saying the Health Care Reform bill is an essential part of their plan.

          At any rate, I’d rather have a conversation about the plan on its merits. So thanks. I realize that it’s not exactly the Brookings Institute, but I think equating their plan with the Tea Party is incorrect.

          1. their positions, and their publications for about a week now.  I’m on my blackberry, so no links right now.

            Maybe some day when I’ve got the hours, I’ll run a diary.

            And, for the record I never, or at least I didn’t mean to, equate them with the baggers.  I think they are more savvy, and therefore more potentially dangerous, than that.  I did say that the issues that they advocate most strongly for are mainstream Republican.

        3. I thought I might be the only one catching this. The range of the debate in our society has narrowed to the point of being meaningless often it seems.

      3. I tried to find something specific on their web site, but quickly lost patience (it really seems to be written for people who want no details). What is their stance on the expiration of the Bush tax cuts? If (as I suspect) they don’t have one, then the whole premise is insultingly dishonest.

        Are they endorsing the Simpson-Bowles proposal to cut taxes on the rich and cut benefits for everyone else?

          1. What a bunch of shithead liars. Fuck them.

            And they’re really not advocating any kind of positions that are politically unpopular. They’re just saying, “Somebody should do something about this thing nobody likes! And be courageous about it!” Gosh, what a new and profound statement.

            I mean, I could come up with a plan to eliminate the deficit, but who gives a shit what my plan is since politicians won’t vote for it?

            But Peterson has a shitload of money and could actually influence this debate in a positive direction. Instead he’s just subtly trying to make corporate tax cuts sound like revenue-raisers using typical supply-side Laffer curve nonsense, while making no other original contribution to the debate. The appropriate analogy to him making this argument in the middle of the deepest recession since the 1930s is the guy who steals a TV in the confusion of a natural disaster.

            Fuck him to hell.

            1. Lets tackle that huge debt by taxing everything else but corporations.  Yeah, fuck him.

              And speaking of Laffer, whenever his fucking ridiculously stupid ass name is mentioned this HAS TO BE POSTED EVERY TIME:

              What recession are you talking about ?  You’re all just being paranoid.  Go back to your six pack.

              1. but, . . . thank God for Laffer and his curves!

                After having been dressed down on two separate diaries on two consecutive days by two different polsters (both of whom I consider to be intelligent and reasonable folks) with “Dio . . . did you even read . . .?” comments, I was beginning to wonder whether my large march towards senility had gone into quick time mode.

                I’m now guessing that it’s just progressing at the same moderate pace . . . and, that I still merely an opinionated jerk.  

                1. is a synonym for blogger. 🙂

                  I suppose my desire for this to be something truly non-partisan, and not just a dressing-up of the more moderate Republican ideas of the early 90s, blinded me somewhat to the real arguments they were making–also the fact that they are supportive of the health care bill. I am a staunch believer in reducing the debt, and I still agree with the overall sentiment of the ads (raise public awareness about unsustainable deficit spending) but it appears you were right about the smoke and mirrors when it comes to the policy prescription.

        2. He advocates treating all income the same – which I’d guess means he agree that anyone who claims  more than 10% of their annual gross income from dividends, interest or cap gains should pay FICA (self employment tax) on it.  

          Then again, I could be wrong and what he really wants is a flat income tax  or abolition of the income tax, to be replaced by the national sales tax.

          1. because after a certain point, there just comes a natural limit on how much you can consume right? I mean how many jets can one really buy anyway? Two? Three? A fleet of twenty? What a great limiter of taxes on the wealthy!

  3. A brilliant rant in reply to Buffalo Bills Steve Johnson and his meltdown over fumbling the winning pass in overtime against the Steelers.

    Get those fingers out of your divine ears. Don’t pretend you’re not listening. Don’t pretend you’re not reading this column right now. I know you are. That is, when you’re not reading brainless tweets from NFL receivers or soaking up praise from the winners at the Country Music Awards or cringing as almost everyone violently misquotes you, over and over again, from the Vatican to Saddleback, GOP rallies to Taliban cave meetings. That must be fun.

  4. ….sorry, but I have to pimp this every chance I get. Penalty Box be damned!!!

    http://www.9news.com/news/loca…

    I’m really glad that Judge Ron Crowder finally got some on-air time to talk about his court. The SAMHSA grant got this thing off the ground, but it was his insistence that CoSprings do this court that really made it possible.  

  5. FRANKFORT [Kentucky] – On Wednesday, Gov. Steve Beshear [D] unveiled plans for a new tourist attraction in Grant County that will feature a full-scale replica of Noah’s Ark.

    Reported in nky.com.



    An artist[‘s] conception of the proposed theme park.

    Beshear said the group has applied for [$37 million] tax incentives via the Kentucky Tourism Development Act, and the fact that the project has a religious theme should not be a factor in the approval process.

    Well, that may be so, but to my great disappointment:

    “(There will) probably be no live dinosaurs,” [Mike Zovath, senior vice president of Answers in Genesis] said, laughing.

    The claim is that this project will provide 900 jobs. Given that the original ark project only employed 8 people (and it was made from gopher wood, it floated, and it carried dinosaurs), I’m thinking the job projections have been inflated.

    3. It would be a powerful demonstration that if the Ark had been built to G-d’s specifications it could not hold the 7 of every clean and 2 of every unclean specie (Genesis 7:1-5) in the world, thereby demonstrating the falsity of a literal translation once and for all.

      1. all the animals magically shrunk and were cryogenically frozen as they crossed the gangplank. This is how they didn’t have to worry about storing all the feed needed too for such a long and perilous journey.

        Reminds me of a time in Naval training when a devout Christian who really believed the Earth was only six thousand years old was trying to convert me. When I asked what about the dinosaurs, he said God had put the fossils in the ground as is to test our faith. There never were any real dinosaurs roaming the Earth.

        You can’t defeat that kind of logic! Republicans have learned these lessons well!

    5. Cool Science News of the day from NASA:

      Research of bacteria living in the mud around Mono Lake have uncovered a bacteria that can survive by substituting Arsenic for Phosphorus both in cellular energy transfer (normally performed by ATP), but also within its DNA.

      The organism is capable of living and reproducing without any Phosphorus at all, but it does appear in a normal Phosphorus-based environment.

      The researchers had hoped to find a “shadow biosphere” – completely alien biology based entirely on Arsenic.  Alternately, they had hoped to discover an Arsenic-resistant bacteria.  Instead they found something in-between and perhaps more interesting – something based on a normal organism but capable of using Arsenic effectively.

      This expands our concepts of “life” in our search both here and among the stars.

      1. Our whole concept of life involves DNA.  And our concept of DNA has always involved a certain chemistry.

        The fact that DNA can work with other chemistry tells us that life can take on other forms, none of which we had ever considered, let alone contemplated.

        1. Here’s a good review of why arsenic substitution for phosphorus is (a) not unexpected, (b) not unique, and (c) why arsenic is generally bad for most life forms on this planet.

          The take home message is:

          California is home to some really weird life forms that might as well be from another planet. And there are some cool bacteria in California, too.

          1. It’s in the same column on the periodic table.

            My solid-state chemistry professor, Dr. Rustum Roy, would have been proud of you for noticing that.

            Question one on his mid-term: “Draw and label the periodic table of the elements.”

  6. Perhaps this will inspire our state legislature, facing a $1 billion deficit in the coming session, to consider a similar public works project.

    My vote would be for a 900 foot Jesus constructed at the mousetrap ( I-70 and I-25). No doubt people would come far and wide to see this, and I’m sure the sales of souvenir replicas and other assorted paraphernalia would get us out of our budget fix in no time !

    Let’s Do It !!

    1. of high-resolution video surveillance cameras and parabolic ears on top, we could claim it’s necessary for homeland security and the grants will come rolling in.

        1. I like how the narrator within Neil Young’s song “Ride My Llama” unpretentiously (i.e., ignoramus-like) pronounces it that alternative way.

          I’m gonna ride my llama / From Peru to Texarkana

  7. Oh, yeah, the dedicated and ethical Tea party movement is committed to ending government waste and unnecessary spending.

    And for everyone who believed that bullshit when they voted for those candidates – dumbasses….

    Anti-earmark Tea Party Caucus takes $1 billion in earmarks

    Members of the Congressional Tea Party Caucus may tout their commitment to cutting government spending now, but they used the 111th Congress to request hundreds of earmarks that, taken cumulatively, added more than $1 billion to the federal budget.

    According to a Hotline review of records compiled by Citizens Against Government Waste, the 52 members of the caucus, which pledges to cut spending and reduce the size of government, requested a total of 764 earmarks valued at $1,049,783,150 during Fiscal Year 2010, the last year for which records are available.

    “It’s disturbing to see the Tea Party Caucus requested that much in earmarks. This is their time to put up or shut up, to be blunt,” said David Williams, vice president for policy at Citizens Against Government Waste. “There’s going to be a huge backlash if they continue to request earmarks.”

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_…

    Suckers…

  8. Earlier Thursday, House Speaker-designate John Boehner (R-Ohio) called the vote “chicken crap.”

    The bill stands little chance of passing in the Senate, where Republican leaders have vowed a filibuster.

    http://voices.washingtonpost.c…

    Am I missing something here?

    Does a tax package need to be debated by the Senate in the form it comes from the House, or can they vote on their own package including an extension for everyone, and then send it to reconciliation and pass what the house passed?

    1. So they’ve pledge to stop everything until they get it.

      The Orange Man is right in calling this politics – but it’s the politics the Dems should’ve been doing prior to the Nov elections.

      This middle class tax cut passed the House, and I HOPE it goes to the Senate floor where the Republican’ts are pledging to filibuster it.

      They can rail all they want about politics now, but it’s a nice little “Fuck You” from the outgoing 111th Congress. If they vote against it, it’s the Dem talking point for the next two years…..”The GOP is holding the Middle Class Tax cut hostage to give millionaires a tax break!”

    3. It must originate in the House.

      However, the Senate can offer an alternative by way of amendment, or (what they often do) they can strip down some other revenue bill that’s not considered vital or has been passed in some other form and replace it with their own revenue proposals.

      In this case, the Senate will be offering two possibilities.  They will (attempt to) bring the bill as passed by the House to the floor for debate as-is; at some point they are expected to offer an amendment extending tax cuts a bit further, creating a new bracket at $1,000,000 that will see their tax cuts expire.

      I obviously support the full House package of extending only the tax cuts on the first $250,000, but I think the second option – the millionaire’s option – makes a great talking point should Republicans vote against it

  9. If any of you caught the debate and vote on Rangle’s censure, none other than soon to be former rep Salazar was the presiding officer for a good chunk of it.

    That’s gotta be a fun assignment.  “Hey John, since you’ll be gone in a few weeks, wanna play Speaker for the first Censure vote in 30 years?  Youbetcha!”  😛

    2. .

      that “censure” really means “exoneration.”  

      Otherwise, folks may have been left with the impression that cheating on rent-subsidized housing and fudging one’s taxes and financial disclosures was wrongful conduct.

      Did he get treated worse than earlier crooks like DeLay ?  Indubitably.  

      Was he still a crook ?  Well, I’d have gone to jail if I did what he did, don’cha think ?

      He appealed to memories of his combat service, and to how Adam Clayton Powell was also done wrong.  Not his finest hour, after a remarkable career.

      .

      1. would have given this juvenille delinquent the choice between his belt or having his offenses read out loud at the family dinner table, I would have taken censure every time.

        And, BTW, long time — no read . . . I’m damn tickled to see you’ve found your way back B-X.

    1. This was the suspicious “package”?  Hilarious!

      I suppose any object labeled odd should be blown into chunks.  How silly would you have felt if it had turned out to be a bomb?  Robot, bomb.  Potato, potato.

      I know a corner with a super glued quarter that could use some bomb squad action.  The kids put it down to laugh at people trying to pick it up.  The dad can’t get the damn thing off.  Kids laugh at that too.  In this housing market, money on the sidewalk can’t be a bad thing for the resale value, right?

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